iphone 3g with 3Gs firmware?

[RobbySkateboard]

well it seems the camera updates are video, auto focus and tap to focus. Isn't that stuff just firmware, not hardware? same with the compass, voice control. But video was availible via jailbreak, so I know our 3g iphone's are capable of it. And there are apps for voice control (vlingo namely) and compass is for sure just firmware because there are apps for that as well. And I heard someone say that auto focus is firmware too, so will normal 2008 iphone 3g's get video/auto focus/tap to focus/voice control/compass?

[Timerthy]

The phone will be 3megapixel not 2Mp so there's the hardware upgrade

[Lincoln]

No, not at all. The camera upgrades are based on hardware, not firmware - the camera in the 3GS is totally different from the one in the V1 and the 3G. Voice Control could most likely be achieved on the previous iPhones, though there may some sort of new hardware to make it more accurate. So really, it's more new hardware than you might think. And it won't be possible to run the 3GS firmware on the 3G or V1.

[Eragon]

I'd be curious to know how the OS designations break down now. Have we seen most of the devices Apple is rumored to be releasing?

For example:

V1 - 1,1
3G - 1,2

3Gs - 2,1?

[Timerthy]

Well, I just got a iphone 3G for Christmas so I'm not interested any a new phone or fancy upgrade just yet. 3.0 yes, but 3Gs not yet

[2white2fight]

I'd be curious to know how the OS designations break down now. Have we seen most of the devices Apple is rumored to be releasing?

For example:

V1 - 1,1
3G - 1,2

3Gs - 2,1?

yea why didnt they just make it 1,3

[bigdog5142]

I'm curious about the A2DP Bluetooth support. They had indicated that and it looked like it would be "unlocked" on the 3G, but there was no mention of that. Has it fallen by the wayside? That's one thing I was REALLY looking forward to!

[psylichon]

well it seems the camera updates are video, auto focus and tap to focus. Isn't that stuff just firmware, not hardware? same with the compass, voice control. But video was availible via jailbreak, so I know our 3g iphone's are capable of it. And there are apps for voice control (vlingo namely) and compass is for sure just firmware because there are apps for that as well. And I heard someone say that auto focus is firmware too, so will normal 2008 iphone 3g's get video/auto focus/tap to focus/voice control/compass?

1. Autofocus: definitely a hardware feature, not achievable with software
2. Compass: uses a magnetometer. No apps can do this without one.
3. Voice control: Vlingo and Google both send voice data over the internet to be processed by VERY fast computers. To do it locally probably requires a dedicated DSP chip in order for it to be in any way useable.
4. Video: While it's true the current gen can technically do video, it's very slow and choppy under less than ideal conditions, and it's simply not up to Apple's standard, so they won't allow it.


So yeah, while it would be great to keep getting features forever, pretty much everything you mentioned requires specialized hardware to make it work right, so one must upgrade.

[RobbySkateboard]

1. Autofocus: definitely a hardware feature, not achievable with software
2. Compass: uses a magnetometer. No apps can do this without one.
3. Voice control: Vlingo and Google both send voice data over the internet to be processed by VERY fast computers. To do it locally probably requires a dedicated DSP chip in order for it to be in any way useable.
4. Video: While it's true the current gen can technically do video, it's very slow and choppy under less than ideal conditions, and it's simply not up to Apple's standard, so they won't allow it.


So yeah, while it would be great to keep getting features forever, pretty much everything you mentioned requires specialized hardware to make it work right, so one must upgrade.

Thank you for a very knowledgeable reply.

but now this raises another question for me, once a jailbreak comes out for it, and normal 3g iphones can obtain video (as laggy as it may be) will we be able to mms that video?


Off topic, but is anyone else finding it hard to pluralize 3g as to not raise confusion? I keep saying 3g iphones because if I put 3gs or even 3g's I'm afraid people will think I'm talking about the new iphone

[mcmlxxxvi]

1. Autofocus: definitely a hardware feature, not achievable with software
2. Compass: uses a magnetometer. No apps can do this without one.
3. Voice control: Vlingo and Google both send voice data over the internet to be processed by VERY fast computers. To do it locally probably requires a dedicated DSP chip in order for it to be in any way useable.
4. Video: While it's true the current gen can technically do video, it's very slow and choppy under less than ideal conditions, and it's simply not up to Apple's standard, so they won't allow it.


So yeah, while it would be great to keep getting features forever, pretty much everything you mentioned requires specialized hardware to make it work right, so one must upgrade.


Hate to burst your bubble there mate, but the only thing you got right is the compass feature. Which is the only one which operates on HW...
Video camera features are handled by software and so is voice control..
CPU isn't a problem; arm6 and arm7 are binary compatible. GFX hardware, OTOH is a different story. But that should all work. The big issue here is packaging an ipsw that iTunes likes...

[mcmlxxxvi]

Hate to burst YOUR bubble, mate, but no one talks to Dave that way. D:<

Why would you want to use your first post ever trying to correct a Mod/very knowledgeable person, anyway?

Dude.. if it was my intention to "put him in his place" it would've been a way longer post.. I'm not here to diss anyone .. I'm just stating the facts here.. and pointing out the flaws in his post..


As for your question... you answered it yourself.. I used my first post to correct him.. the fact that he is a mod/very knowledgeable person is of no importance.. even the knowledgeable get things wrong sometimes..

so take a chill pill.. it's not my fault you took it the wrong way..

[Dustu2]

Dude.. if it was my intention to "put him in his place" it would've been a way longer post.. I'm not here to diss anyone .. I'm just stating the facts here.. and pointing out the flaws in his post..


As for your question... you answered it yourself.. I used my first post to correct him.. the fact that he is a mod/very knowledgeable person is of no importance.. even the knowledgeable get things wrong sometimes..

so take a chill pill.. it's not my fault you took it the wrong way..

Not a problem. I just like to spend my spare time kissing up to important people. :dft012:wink

[mcmlxxxvi]

Not a problem. I just like to spend my spare time kissing up to important people. :dft012:wink

So I've noticed yeah.. lol

[Tinman]

Hate to burst your bubble there mate, but the only thing you got right is the compass feature. Which is the only one which operates on HW...
Nonsense, mate.

Aside from the camera's obvious hardware resolution difference, the camera in the iPhone 1G and 3G does not have true hardware auto-focus. The 3GS does. That's right, it does: the lens physically moves to focus. The 3G's camera wouldn't even work with 3GS "firmware."

Moreover, a 50% faster CPU, combined with twice the RAM and cache, and other improvements, make things like video and voice control much more doable, at least from Apple's perspective, on the 3GS.

And while ARMv7 can obviously run all ARMv6 instructions, the same is not true the other way around--v7 has a broader instruction set.

Feel free to come back when you have fully-functioning 3GS firmware running in a 3G. Should be a long wait...



--
Mike

[Spikey911]

To me it seems Voice Control would be possible, but that's it.

[mcmlxxxvi]

Nonsense, mate.

Aside from the camera's obvious hardware resolution difference, the camera in the iPhone 1G and 3G does not have true hardware auto-focus. The 3GS does. That's right, it does: the lens physically moves to focus. The 3G's camera wouldn't even work with 3GS "firmware."

Moreover, a 50% faster CPU, combined with twice the RAM and cache, and other improvements, make things like video and voice control much more doable, at least from Apple's perspective, on the 3GS.

And while ARMv7 can obviously run all ARMv6 instructions, the same is not true the other way around--v7 has a broader instruction set.

Feel free to come back when you have fully-functioning 3GS firmware running in a 3G. Should be a long wait...



--
Mike

If you read my post correctly i never mentioned hardware changes.. but the software which applies for 3gs.. which CAN be applied on a 3g and work well for that matter too.. I never mentioned performance which would of course differ from the 3GS .. cdz, cdnz & it are a problem but there are ways around it.. as I mentioned.. the only big issue here is actually rebuilding the ipsw so itunes will accept it.. it could be done in a matter of days through cydia packages.. but that's not a challenge.. the real hack would be doing this through itunes with no errors at so ever.. so please.. read before you reply with stuff already known to most of us..
as for auto focus.. it can be applied through software.. of course it will not be the same as an actual auto focus camera.. but that doesn't mean it cannot be done.. Cheers

[Tinman]

If you read my post correctly i never mentioned hardware changes.. but the software which applies for 3gs.. which CAN be applied on a 3g and work well for that matter too.. I never mentioned performance which would of course differ from the 3GS .. cdz, cdnz & it are a problem but there are ways around it.. as I mentioned.. the only big issue here is actually rebuilding the ipsw so itunes will accept it.. it could be done in a matter of days through cydia packages.. but that's not a challenge.. the real hack would be doing this through itunes with no errors at so ever.. so please.. read before you reply with stuff already known to most of us..
as for auto focus.. it can be applied through software.. of course it will not be the same as an actual auto focus camera.. but that doesn't mean it cannot be done.. Cheers
Again, nonsense, mate. I don't need to go past the camera to illustrate this.

Let me make it easier to follow, since you appear to be dancing right now.

Psylichon listed items that were different from a hardware perspective between the 3GS and 1G/3G. The very first item was this:"1. Autofocus: definitely a hardware feature, not achievable with software."
You essentially replied that he was wrong about that, as you said he was wrong about everything aside from the compass (heck, why stop at that... by your logic that can be done via software too).

Exactly what API or framework, SDK or private, can be used, right now, with 1G/3G iPhones, that can poll the camera to determine and control its focus? If the answer is no, how exactly can auto-focus be added when there is no way to tell what is in focus and what isn't? Post-processing doesn't count.

You seem to think that if you take 3GS firmware code, modify it so it is no longer 3GS code, you have still added 3GS firmware to a 3G. That ain't so, dude.




--
Mike

[mcmlxxxvi]

Again, nonsense, mate. I don't need to go past the camera to illustrate this.

Let me make it easier to follow, since you appear to be dancing right now.

Psylichon listed items that were different from a hardware perspective between the 3GS and 1G/3G. The very first item was this:"1. Autofocus: definitely a hardware feature, not achievable with software."
You essentially replied that he was wrong about that, as you said he was wrong about everything aside from the compass (heck, why stop at that... by your logic that can be done via software too).

Exactly what API, SDK or private, can be used, right now, with 1G/3G iPhones, that can poll the camera to determine and control its focus? If the answer is no, how exactly can auto-focus be added when there is no way to tell what is in focus and what isn't? Post-processing doesn't count.

You seem to think that if you take 3GS firmware code, modify it so it is no longer 3GS code, you have still added 3GS firmware to a 3G. That ain't so, dude.




--
Mike

I think you're misunderstanding what I'm trying to point out here..

What I'm saying is: Video features & Voice Control can be applied to 3G..
same way as small features like Battery Percentage can be activated on 3G as well.. Maybe I didn't make myself clear but of course you can't take the actual 3GS firmware and apply it to 3G.. but the software (features mentioned above) are able to be implemented and work fine on a 3G phone.. like I said cdz cdnz and it are a problem but there are ways around it.. Auto focus can be applied through software.. goolge if you must.. but I never went down that road, you did.. all I'm pointing out here is that most features mentioned were according to him hardware bonded..They aren't.. expect for the magnetometer which is not in a 3G..

[Tinman]

I think you're misunderstanding what I'm trying to point out here..

What I'm saying is: Video features & Voice Control can be applied to 3G..
same way as small features like Battery Percentage can be activated on 3G as well.. Maybe I didn't make myself clear but of course you can't take the actual 3GS firmware and apply it to 3G..

I don't wish to debate this any longer but I think you may have misunderstood just what psylichon was responding to. This could be due to resurrecting a thread that was started before the 3GS's general release.

The OP was under the mistaken impression that 3GS features such as the compass and camera (even its resolution) were merely firmware updates. So if the 3GS firmware was installed on a 3G he'd have, essentially, a 3GS. Psylichon pointed out that there really were hardware changes in the 3GS.

Then, a month and a half later, you strolled in with the bold assertion that psylichon was nearly completely wrong. He actually wasn't wrong, if you understand what he was replying to. I can't make it any clearer than this.

But either way, welcome to EIC!



--
Mike

[iNinja]

I don't wish to debate this any longer but I think you may have misunderstood just what psylichon was responding to. This could be due to resurrecting a thread that was started before the 3GS's general release.

The OP was under the mistaken impression that 3GS features such as the compass and camera (even its resolution) were merely firmware updates. So if the 3GS firmware was installed on a 3G he'd have, essentially, a 3GS. Psylichon pointed out that there really were hardware changes in the 3GS.

Then, a month and a half later, you strolled in with the bold assertion that psylichon was nearly completely wrong. He actually wasn't wrong, if you understand what he was replying to. I can't make it any clearer than this.

But either way, welcome to EIC!

--
Mike

Im glad you went through all that - stopped me having to. ha.

[Napoleon_PhoneApart]

Hate to burst YOUR bubble, mate, but no one talks to Dave that way. D:<

Why would you want to use your first post ever trying to correct a Mod/very knowledgeable person, anyway?

Let the guy talk. No one here is immune to criticism. I happen to agree with Dave's post, but don't start censoring content that doesn't violate forum rules.

[ethanjsl]

How about hybrid firmware. Has anyone ruled that out yet.