apple loves to nickel and dime customers

[KTran]

so i finally decided to give my brother the iTouch which came with my purchase of a macbook just before school started.

when he opened and experienced it for the first time last night and today, he asked if there are any games? this is boring.

i just learned that his device is on version 1.1.5. so i tell him to update and he says something about paying for it?! so i say no, my iphone had a free update, why would you!?

so i search; come to my surprise. there definitely was a charge to update 2.1 firmware. what a crock of s**t.

anybody feel this way too?

[Leo Renard]

There were methods on how to update to 2.x for free, but I'm not going to say anything as I don't think that's allowed.

[acosmichippo]

i agree, it's BS. Completely inexcusable.

[UFGator]

AMEN! I helped a relative with their touch and couldn't believe you had to pay for the SW upgrade. What a crock. That is second only to the fact that if I buy a song for $0.99 I have to purchase the ringtone if I want to use the song on my iPhone. Of course Apple can kiss my a** because I get around that fact (like most of you), but it shouldn't be that way...

[Youngbinks]

While the upgrade offers quite a bit more functionality I think it is a bit ridiculous to charge. No other iPods have required a fee to upgrade to the newest firmware and neither should the Touch. Imagine the day when iTunes is no longer free to use. Eek.

[Leo Renard]

While the upgrade offers quite a bit more functionality I think it is a bit ridiculous to charge. No other iPods have required a fee to upgrade to the newest firmware and neither should the Touch. Imagine the day when iTunes is no longer free to use. Eek.

Personally I'd be more worried about the App store than iTunes.

[acosmichippo]

apple will never charge for itunes... they want that on as many computers as possible to sell downloads. Of course, by that same logic, they should make the touch 2.0 software free, so who knows what they're thinking.

[KTran]

this is just unbelievable... i really want him to be able to enjoy 2.1 functions, mainly app store. he just loves mini games.

he tried a free upgrade but it just crashed. luckily it rebooted fine!! phew.
i wish i knew how to it myself. make things easy n done with...

thanks for your input fellas!

[Ramesh]

While the upgrade offers quite a bit more functionality I think it is a bit ridiculous to charge. No other iPods have required a fee to upgrade to the newest firmware and neither should the Touch. Imagine the day when iTunes is no longer free to use. Eek.
Yea, I agree with you. I never understood or agreed. Is every update $10?

[JasontheGreat]

I did the "alternate" to get the update with no charge. Really simple, just google or checkout some forums.

[PepeRB29]

dude its not that hard, pm me for a link to download the free torrent for 2.0 update. once you have 2.0, you can update for free. it is EASY!!!!

you are welcome in advance.

[coasts]

i don't think this qualifies as a "nickel and dime" scenario. i like that they update their products and make the new features available at a minimal cost. imagine if you had to buy a whole new iPod just to get the improvements?

i'd say that they are guilty of this when it comes to iTunes ringtones...that's a rip off.

[patrickj]

i agree, it's BS. Completely inexcusable.

Plus one here. I thought the Touch was marketed as a sort of 'iPhone without the phone' - not without the phone, and the latest OS / apps / cool features.

Plus, is this the second time Touch users have had to fork out for an update??? Didn't they also get stiffed for 1.1.4? (or are you entitled to next one free if you pay for one?)

[acosmichippo]

i don't think this qualifies as a "nickel and dime" scenario. i like that they update their products and make the new features available at a minimal cost. imagine if you had to buy a whole new iPod just to get the improvements?

i'd say that they are guilty of this when it comes to iTunes ringtones...that's a rip off.

the problem i have with it is that they were developing these features for the iPhone anyway... which they have provided to those owners at no cost. What's the difference between iphones and ipod touches that would justify the price for the update?

secondly, they didn't even raise the price of the following ipod models that came with the updated software. If the price was intended to cover extra expenses for developing for the ipod touch, shouldn't it be reflected in the new touch's price as well?

[Swagger]

One day people will realize. Apple has great products but they are not your friend. They only want your money. I personally think it is an extreme case of pettiness on Apple's part. Next they will want your first born son. Pay for Apple to put their App Store on the iPod. Greed at it's finest!!! Mark

Someone has to pay for Steve's Jet fuel.

[Youngbinks]

A company that wants to make a profit? Imagine...


My other opinion is at the top of the thread already.

[Swagger]

A company that wants to make a profit? Imagine...


My other opinion is at the top of the thread already.

Come on Phil there is a fine line between legitimate profit and greed. Why charge youngsters to update a device they have already bought from you??? Especially when you are adding an option that benefits the company as far as more sales (The App Store). Also why is it fair to include the update free on some iPods but charge on others??? Next time you update your iPhone why not send Apple a donation to help their bottom line since you see nothing wrong with charging for updates. Mark

[aggieman]

i don't think this qualifies as a "nickel and dime" scenario. i like that they update their products and make the new features available at a minimal cost. imagine if you had to buy a whole new iPod just to get the improvements?

i'd say that they are guilty of this when it comes to iTunes ringtones...that's a rip off.

most every other audio/video player on the market provides their updates for free. Even the much maligned Zune offered a rather nifty update here recently.

[Youngbinks]

Come on Phil there is a fine line between legitimate profit and greed. Why charge youngsters to update a device they have already bought from you??? Especially when you are adding an option that benefits the company as far as more sales (The App Store). Also why is it fair to include the update free on some iPods but charge on others??? Next time you update your iPhone why not send Apple a donation to help their bottom line since you see nothing wrong with charging for updates. Mark

Well if you properly knew how to read the thread then you would realize that nearly 2 months ago I stated how RIDICULOUS it is for Apple to charge for iPod Touch owners to update to the new firmware. Nice reading comprehension.

The remark I made was done because you reply now (in seemingly every thread) about how Apple is out only to rip people off.

[Swagger]

Well if you properly knew how to read the thread then you would realize that nearly 2 months ago I stated how RIDICULOUS it is for Apple to charge for iPod Touch owners to update to the new firmware. Nice reading comprehension.

The remark I made was done because you reply now (in seemingly every thread) about how Apple is out only to rip people off.

I comprehended exactly what I read above. Why would I think you contradicted yourself elsewhere just to address my comments. Maybe my problem is I need something fresh and new from Apple to get me excited again. I guess in this lull of product releases. All I can see is their faults. And charging a kid ten bucks to upgrade his/her iPod is a fault.

Phil just to make you happy. I am going to write an I love Apple thread. Look out for it soon it will be hot! LOL, Mark

[Youngbinks]

Mark your attempts at dethroning Apple are sad. I didn't contradict myself at all. I stand by my first assessment that it is ridiculous for Apple to charge for an iPod Touch update. I was referring to the fact that in every thread you are sure to make a statement about how the big bad corporations are only out to make a profit. It's rather tiring and childish.

[psylichon]

Mark, I think most people agree with your sentiments, but not with your dramatics. Not every decision Apple makes is an indication of pure greed or evil. Why must you always take such an extreme stance?

Yeah, it sucks to pay for updates, but sometimes companies make you do that. Can't we disagree with this particular decision without condemning the entire company as a whole? Apple does a lot of stuff right, agreed? Surely we can find a common ground here. Once you temper your statements just a bit, I think you'll see a lot of people agreeing with you more often.

Not that that's the point though, right? ;)

[up10ad]

Come on Phil there is a fine line between legitimate profit and greed.
Personally Mark, I don't believe in corporate pricing greed. Maximizing profit is their business. Corporations may indeed charge what is considered 'high' prices, but only up to the point that consumers perceive it as too high (greedy), at which point they don't buy or take their business elsewhere (you practice this per your previous posts). Then the corporation either restructures their pricing or sales decline, etc. Striking the balance between keeping the customer and making as much as possible is their job. You all still are buying updates, right ;)

This is the 'vote with your pocketbook' action, and it is in place all the time, whether you are cognizant of it or not. So, I view Apple's prices as high, but until they start losing customers over it I don't think the label greedy applies.

[Swagger]

Personally Mark, I don't believe in corporate pricing greed. Maximizing profit is their business. Corporations may indeed charge what is considered 'high' prices, but only up to the point that consumers perceive it as too high (greedy), at which point they don't buy or take their business elsewhere (you practice this per your previous posts). Then the corporation either restructures their pricing or sales decline, etc. Striking the balance between keeping the customer and making as much as possible is their job. You all still are buying updates, right ;)

This is the 'vote with your pocketbook' action, and it is in place all the time, whether you are cognizant of it or not. So, I view Apple's prices as high, but until they start losing customers over it I don't think the label greedy applies.

Rick,
I don't really have a problem with Apple's prices. It's just all the pay extra for every little thing that bothers me. If I'm already paying a premium price then give me everything that comes with it...Mark

Dave,
As far as people agreeing with me. I could care less I am going to be me. Like I have said so many times here. A forum where everyone agrees with everyone is useless...Mark

Phil,
I'm sorry that you feel the way you do but you are entitled to your opinion. I think you misunderstand me. I never said or complained that 3000.00 is to much for a MBP or 600 for an iPhone or 399 for an iPod. My issue is with I paid 3000, 600, 399 why do I have to pay more for components taken out of the box just to boost Apple's bottom line. It is Apple that is being childish by doing that. I am just saying how I feel about it. Most people do not mind buying what they want. I think everyone takes exception to being made a fool out of...Mark

[coasts]

let's avoid personalizing Apple. They are a company. No, they're not our "friend" and they're not being "childish". They're doing what it takes to not only earn a profit, but to earn the maximum profit that their market will allow.

An iPod is a luxury. Luxuries come at a cost. If you deem it worthy, you pay the price. If you want to stand on a soapbox, do it at the gas pumps. While gas prices are soaring through the roof, oil companies are showing record high profits. This is an issue worth fighting over.

and separately, Aggie, Apple has also given numerous free updates. the more substantial updates come at a cost, which i don't think is unreasonable. Apple could easily stop offering these improvements in the form of firmware and simply begin selling them individually through the App Store. Would you pay for Google Maps Street View and Public Transport Navigation if they became available for $9.99?

[psylichon]

Dave,
As far as people agreeing with me. I could care less I am going to be me. Like I have said so many times here. A forum where everyone agrees with everyone is useless...Mark

I hear you on that one. And that's all fine and good as long as you can take the resulting disagreements with a grain of salt instead of personally. This includes not insulting others for not feeling as strongly as you do on the subject. Because this will happen often, ya drama queen :tounge:

[Swagger]

let's avoid personalizing Apple. They are a company. No, they're not our "friend" and they're not being "childish". They're doing what it takes to not only earn a profit, but to earn the maximum profit that their market will allow.

An iPod is a luxury. Luxuries come at a cost. If you deem it worthy, you pay the price. If you want to stand on a soapbox, do it at the gas pumps. While gas prices are soaring through the roof, oil companies are showing record high profits. This is an issue worth fighting over.

and separately, Aggie, Apple has also given numerous free updates. the more substantial updates come at a cost, which i don't think is unreasonable. Apple could easily stop offering these improvements in the form of firmware and simply begin selling them individually through the App Store. Would you pay for Google Maps Street View and Public Transport Navigation if they became available for $9.99?

Coasts,
Are you saying it is ok to be robbed by the Apple but not the petroleum companies???

I am not just ticked off at Apple. We just happen to discuss Apple here. I am ticked off at the whole corporate greed enviroment now present in the U.S. Haven't these large corporations learned yet how greed destroys everything it touches. Example on a small scale. I will use Verizon since Apple seems to be a lightening rod here. I noticed an addition 40.00 on my Verizon bill in the "other" category. I called to find out what "other". The very helpful rep explained to me that I had gone over on my data usage. I asked how could that be since I have the unlimited data plan. She informed me that only applies to web surfing and email. Unlimited data with Verizon does not include downloads. I had downloaded some rather large RAW photograph files and Verizon charged me by the MB. I asked what difference does up or down load make unlimited data means unlimited data. Well I guess to everyone but Verizon. I told her my contract says unlimited and I am not paying for any extra data. She said well your phone will be turned off. I called my attorney. I am sick of being bent over everyday by these greedy corporations. I am also filing a complaint with the FCC. Someone has got to stand up at some point and say enough is enough. All of you might think I'm crazy for doing so but I live for me not for you. Mark

[coasts]

a few weeks ago i walked into a restaurant needing to use a bathroom. on my way out, i found a twenty dollar bill on the floor.

some days you're the bird. other days you're the windshield. i'd like to think it all evens out.

[patrickj]

Coasts,
Are you saying it is ok to be robbed by the Apple but not the petroleum companies???

I am not just ticked off at Apple. We just happen to discuss Apple here. I am ticked off at the whole corporate greed enviroment now present in the U.S. Haven't these large corporations learned yet how greed destroys everything it touches. Example on a small scale. I will use Verizon since Apple seems to be a lightening rod here. I noticed an addition 40.00 on my Verizon bill in the "other" category. I called to find out what "other". The very helpful rep explained to me that I had gone over on my data usage. I asked how could that be since I have the unlimited data plan. She informed me that only applies to web surfing and email. Unlimited data with Verizon does not include downloads. I had downloaded some rather large RAW photograph files and Verizon charged me by the MB. I asked what difference does up or down load make unlimited data means unlimited data. Well I guess to everyone but Verizon. I told her my contract says unlimited and I am not paying for any extra data. She said well your phone will be turned off. I called my attorney. I am sick of being bent over everyday by these greedy corporations. I am also filing a complaint with the FCC. Someone has got to stand up at some point and say enough is enough. All of you might think I'm crazy for doing so but I live for me not for you. Mark

I'm sure Coasts will reply more eloquently than I will - but what I took from his comment was not about if it's ok to be robbed by Apple, but more about the fact that Apple sells us luxury / leisure / entertainment items. Exxon and the like sell us something that for many is a necessity. It seems clear to me that one is more worthy of uproar than the other if pricing or practices are extreme.

[Swagger]

I'm sure Coasts will reply more eloquently than I will - but what I took from his comment was not about if it's ok to be robbed by Apple, but more about the fact that Apple sells us luxury / leisure / entertainment items. Exxon and the like sell us something that for many is a necessity. It seems clear to me that one is more worthy of uproar than the other if pricing or practices are extreme.

The point I was trying to make is be it a need or necessity. The root cause for all that is happening is greed. Our country is being consumed by it and it is destroying us.

I do understand your explanation and it does make sense. I will say this though. A person/company can only ride your back if you allow them to climb on. If people would just lose their "well this is how it is" and stand up and fight back a lot of things could change. Gas would have never reached the price it did if our freaking government had of put a stop to speculation (more greed). Every where you turn. Greed, Greed, Greed!!!

Why are we American's paying the price (by deflated home values, huge losses in our financial portfolios and so foth) for a bunch of a**holes that got crazy rich... over leveraging the middle class. Now we as tax payers give those same a**holes 700 billion dollars to bail them out??? Not one of those CEO's lost their job AIG, Goldman Sachs, Freddie Mac and so on. So please excuse me if I am just a bit pissed off. Why is this all happening because we (well not me) have become to freaking passive it sickens me to even think of it. What about Bernard Madoff he scams 50 billion dollars and walks the streets of New York (with a tether and on house arrest). That SOB should be up under the jail or sentenced to death. We are talking 50 billion not 50 thousand.

I'm going to just shut up because you guys seem like oh well all of this is ok. I'm sorry but I don't feel that way...Mark

[coasts]

http://www.earthhouse.com/images/inst_karma/Heron.jpg

...and it won't be broadcast over the web. if you're looking to gain support for your cause, an iPhone forum is probably the second worse place to start. you'll have worse luck on everythingBB.

all i'm saying is that sure, there are problems with this country, but your constant attempts to incite a riot are grossly misdirected and come off as half-assed. you can't call "us" complacent just because we're not jumping up and down about these trivial matters.

the problem with the "revolution" is that the revolters could never focus on any one issue. get an agenda that means something and then you'll have supporters.

[Swagger]

http://www.earthhouse.com/images/inst_karma/Heron.jpg

...and it won't be broadcast over the web. if you're looking to gain support for your cause, an iPhone forum is probably the second worse place to start. you'll have worse luck on everythingBB.

all i'm saying is that sure, there are problems with this country, but your constant attempts to incite a riot are grossly misdirected and come off as half-assed. you can't call "us" complacent just because we're not jumping up and down about these trivial matters.

the problem with the "revolution" is that the revolters could never focus on any one issue. get an agenda that means something and then you'll have supporters.
Coasts,



P.S. Great Gil Scott-Heron album cover. I wish I was of age during that era. You are right people then failed at their attempts not so much because they were misguided. More because the government fought a very covert and successful war against them. Incorporating the uses of drugs, intimidation, lies and so forth. At least they attempted to make a stand. I would rather fail anyday than not try or accept this is just how it has to be. Mark

[coasts]

yeah, the late '60s were great. that's when Rick and I met...i've been following him ever since.

[up10ad]

Stop following me coasts!

[Swagger]

If you guys didn't have me to disagree with. What would you talk about right now??? The latest (non present) iPhone update maybe??? LOL, Mark

It's a new year let's just all get along please...

[iquanyin]

my programmer friend says apple has to charge for touch updates because of some legal thing (that i don't feel like googling right now).

[hitrho5]

my programmer friend says apple has to charge for touch updates because of some legal thing (that i don't feel like googling right now).

I think I know why Apple charges for major iTouch updates. This MAY NOT BE TRUE but it is just my theory.

Imagine that there are 2 people.

Person 1 buys an 8gb iPhone for $199. They pay that plus tax and a monthly phone bill for it. All software updates are free.

Person 2 buys an 8gb iPod Touch for $229. They pay that plus tax, but wait..... its not a phone!.....so NO phone bill.

My point: The iphone buyers end up paying more in the long run, so im guessing that apple charged for itouch updates to level the prices.

Price comparisons:

iPhone3G: 8GB - $199
16GB - $299

iPod Touch 8GB - $229
16GB - $299
32GB - $399