California judge says Sprint must pay $73M in ETF case

[mlass]

Maybe At&t and other wireless will follow

Consumer advocates are calling this preliminary decision a victory and saying that early termination fees unfairly restrict consumers from switching service. Wireless operators, meanwhile, say that ETFs are necessary because they subsidize a portion of the cost of the device and need to recoup those expenses.

http://fiercewireless.com/story/california-judge-says-sprint-must-pay-73m-etf-case/2008-07-29?utm_medium=rss&utm_source=rss&cmp-id=OTC-RSS-FW0

[dturner]

Any way you cut it, we are going to pay. If ETF get thrown out the there will be no more subsidized phones and rates could go up too. I would rather leave things just the way their are.

[aenti]

I personally don't care about ETF. I've stuck with ATT for a long time, don't plan on leaving.

This has been addressed in another thread.

[Youngbinks]

I agree with cellular companies on this one. The phones are provided at a very low price because the provider is footing part of the bill. What's stopping someone from signing a new contract every week? The providers need to make sure that they're not going to lose money each time someone changes their mind.

[SmartAlx]

It's not so black and white when cell phone companies do NOT subsidize the phones, as they did not with the V1 iPhone.

If you sign up with a cellphone provider but you bring your own unlocked phone that you purchased legally for $400 from say Amazon, their contract still enables them to charge you an ETF, even though you did not receive the discount on a phone. When this happens, their argument that they need to recoup the cost of a device they didn't subsidize doesn't hold any water.

[OJsakila]

I wouldn't hold my breath with ANYTHING that some quack California judge says...





They're marrying gays and peddling dope on the street corners.... hatefully disrespecting our military and allowing "safe havens" for illegal aliens...
They are at the very root of what is destroying America.

[jjvaldez]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

harsh words............

who cares if gays get married???
the military is corrupt anyway...
and these "illegal aliens" are people too....

[OJsakila]

^^^^^
your statements are as stoopid as mine! Lololo!!

[cdinca]

I wouldn't hold my breath with ANYTHING that some quack California judge says...

They're marrying gays and peddling dope on the street corners.... hatefully disrespecting our military and allowing "safe havens" for illegal aliens...
They are at the very root of what is destroying America.

Damn Dude! You know how to bring the hate.

[jjvaldez]

He talks **** all the time, but everyone gives him the "oh he's just like that" excuse and think that its ok for him to run his mouth..

[jjvaldez]

really oj, they are not, why hate on the gays? they want to get married, cool, **** it! does it really bother you that dudes kiss dudes???

[theevilone]

yes it does.

[jjvaldez]

^^^
That's too bad


:(

[Witness]

where is the love?

[Swagger]

I think if more people would spend time, tending to "THEIR OWN BUSINESS" and not worrying about others. The world would be a better place. I don't care if a woman marries a woman, or a man marries a man. It is not my life or my business. I don't want gays telling me not to marry a woman, so why should I tell them who to marry? We are all God's children, and so are people that live life different than the main stream...Mark:laugh2:

P.S. Sprint/Nextel May I have my ETF back when I canceled your CRAPPY Nextel service???

[Indy]

yea yea, but anyways,....ETF's suck!:wink:

[danipoak]

I wouldn't hold my breath with ANYTHING that some quack California judge says...





They're marrying gays and peddling dope on the street corners.... hatefully disrespecting our military and allowing "safe havens" for illegal aliens...
They are at the very root of what is destroying America.

Sorry but I sympathise with this man...

[SmartAlx]

Actually some people do believe that same sex marriage is their business because it affects the world in which they live. They believe that it degrades the sanctity of marriage and that it provides a world that isn't as family friendly. Many people believe that children are best served being raised by a man and a woman because men and women are different and both provide something necessary for a child's emotional development. The more gays that get married, the easier and more likely they will want to have children and the more unhealthy people (in the minds of these people) there will be in the world.

So marriage (all marriage - same sex or not) does affect the lives of everybody.

[kunfuzious]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

harsh words............

who cares if gays get married???
the military is corrupt anyway...
and these "illegal aliens" are people too....

1. I don't.

2. This statement is ignorant. If you have some proof or data that validates this please share. Otherwise let's not pass liberal bias off as fact.

3. They are human beings, yes. But they are also a drain on the economy and the United States resources. If they want to apply for citizenship, and pay taxes like the rest of us, then I certainly welcome them to. But until that happens illegal aliens should be deported and we need to secure border. Immediately.

To get back on topic:

As far as ETF's, this would be great news, however I don't see this ruling standing. The ETF's are a major revenue stream for these companies, and the FCC has gone on record stating they don't oppose them.

[Justin]

I wouldn't hold my breath with ANYTHING that some quack California judge says...



Word.


I don't understand how this can be thrown out, or considered illegal.

Its a CONTRACT. You knew damn well about the ETF and you accepted it. How the hell is that illegal? What a bunch of BS.

[Swagger]

1. I don't.

2. This statement is ignorant. If you have some proof or data that validates this please share. Otherwise let's not pass liberal bias off as fact.

3. They are human beings, yes. But they are also a drain on the economy and the United States resources. If they want to apply for citizenship, and pay taxes like the rest of us, then I certainly welcome them to. But until that happens illegal aliens should be deported and we need to secure border. Immediately.


As far as ETF's, this would be great news, however I don;t see this ruling standing.

Unless you are a Native Indian, you are an illegal alien. Should you be deported??? Also, the people coming across the border may just be doing so to reclaim their land, that the United States stole from them long ago. That is not liberal bias, that is fact!!! Mark:angry:

[kunfuzious]

Modern society (the last 500 years included) says I'm an American. My family came to the US via Ellis Island and became citizens. They didn't sneak in and steal, which is more than I can say for the illegal immigrants in this country. They cost the state of California alone over 9 billion a year, and don't contribute. They strain health care, and education. They are thieves.

I'll leave the bleeding heart liberal rhetoric for the rest of you. This post jumped off topic (and I'm guilty of contributing to it). I'll be leaving it now.

[SmartAlx]

Unless you are a Native Indian, you are an illegal alien. Should you be deported??? Also, the people coming across the border may just be doing so to reclaim their land, that the United States stole from them long ago. That is not liberal bias, that is fact!!! Mark:angry:
You can pretty much say the same thing about every nation in the world. Every country is inhabited by someone who hundreds or thousands of years ago invaded the country. Native Americans lost the war when we invaded their land. When you lose a war, well, you lose what you are fighting for.

Those people coming to America from Mexico and elsewhere are not descendents of native Americans. They have even less right to be here. Their ancestors didn't fight a war for this land. Ours did.

[Swagger]

Modern society (the last 500 years included) says I'm an American. My family came to the US via Ellis Island and became citizens. They didn't sneak in and steal, which is more than I can say for the illegal immigrants in this country. They cost the state of California alone over 9 billion a year, and don't contribute. They strain health care, and education. They are thieves.

I'll leave the bleeding heart liberal rhetoric for the rest of you. This post jumped off topic (and I'm guilty of contributing to it). I'll be leaving it now.

Ok then you go out there and pick the produce that you hopefully eat everyday. Or don't cry if lettuce is 15.00$ a head, being picked by American labor. You are getting angry at the wrong people. The illegals are just caught in the middle. If there was no market for their labor in this country, they wouldn't be here. I am sure you are intelligent enough to understand that. Also, on my many trips to California. I never saw any "American's" bent over in the blazing hot sun, for very little pay, picking crops. If you are not prepared to go do that, then stop crying about it.

You speak of liberals being the problem, yet it is the rich conservative corporation's exploitation of cheap labor, that causes the whole illegal immigrant problem. Mark

[SmartAlx]

Wow, so a country with an economic system so screwed up that can't afford to support itself with its own labor force makes it okay to import/export cheap labor? This $15 a head of lettuce is not a valid argument. We should be able to support our own people. If we can't, then that tells you something is seriously wrong with the system. (Thank you Federal Reserve. - You are supposed to protect us from inflation, not create it.) Employing illegals for a fraction of what an American would receive only reinforces the damage to the economic structure of America and gets it even more out of whack. As inflation increases, every industry should increase in proportion. If one doesn't keep up (say because of illegal work) then that throws the whole system out of whack.

[Swagger]

Wow, so a country with an economic system so screwed up that can't afford to support itself with its own labor force makes it okay to import/export cheap labor? This $15 a head of lettuce is not a valid argument. We should be able to support our own people. If we can't, then that tells you something is seriously wrong with the system. (Thank you Federal Reserve. - You are supposed to protect us from inflation, not create it.) Employing illegals for a fraction of what an American would receive only reinforces the damage to the economic structure of America and gets it even more out of whack. As inflation increases, every industry should increase in proportion. If one doesn't keep up (say because of illegal work) then that throws the whole system out of whack.

I agree with the basis of what you are saying. I just differ in this way. I still do not see Americans, lining up to stand in the blazing hot sun many hours a day, bent over, to pick produce.

It's almost like the whole drug use problem. Everyone in the U.S. blames the countries shipping the drugs here. They are not the problem though. Those countries are just supplying a demand. Get your own house in order, stop the use of drugs in the U.S., and drug smuggling will cease. We as American's are always willing to place blame on others (countries & people). Yet we never stop to say, maybe it is us that are to blame...Mark

[SmartAlx]

I agree with the basis of what you are saying. I just differ in this way. I still do not see Americans, lining up to stand in the blazing hot sun many hours a day, bent over, to pick produce. Pay them proper and they will.

[Swagger]

Pay them proper and they will.

Based on your response, the problem lies with the employer and not the employee. Exactly what I have been trying to say. Don't shoot the messenger (if you will)...Mark

Also, I seriously believe that farmers would still be hard pressed, to find a steady work force of Americans willing to do that type of work...Mark

[dturner]

Also, I seriously believe that farmers would still be hard pressed, to find a steady work force of Americans willing to do that type of work...Mark
What about the people in our prison system? It cost the tax payer tons of money to house these scum bags and this would be away to get rid of an illegal problem and fill a void in the work force.

BTW: WTF does all this have to do with ETF?:smile:

[SmartAlx]

Well, the employer can't exactly afford to pay them properly because the system got so out of whack. The problem is the system, not the employer.

Legal immigrants have always been willing to do work that 2nd or 3rd generation Americans weren't willing to do. I know a lot of legal Mexican immigrants here and they did (and some still do) work that your average American wouldn't want to do.

EDIT: Prisoners. Good idea. I like it.

[Swagger]

What about the people in our prison system? It cost the tax payer tons of money to house these scum bags and this would be away to get rid of an illegal problem and fill a void in the work force.

BTW: WTF does all this have to do with ETF?:smile:

It's all relevant, if the "illegals" (you guys word), weren't here and working. They would not be able to get a cell phone. Therefore locking them into a contract/ETF, that they probably can't afford to pay. See how everything comes full circle..Mark:laugh2:

[dturner]

They would not be able to get a cell phone. Therefore locking them into a contract/ETF, that they probably can't afford to pay. See how everything comes full circle..Mark:laugh2:
If they can't get a cell phone, how are they going to get into a contract in the first place.:tounge:

[jjvaldez]

kunfuzious:
just think that next time you are eating your salad, or burger with lettuce and tomatoes that those "illegal" people did contribute...

[aenti]

Edited out.

[OJsakila]

the fact that you don't care speaks volumes. I think that's the very problem. Quit being self involved and spending all this time chatting like a hen on your iphone and get involved with what's going on around you.

[aenti]

Edited out.

[kunfuzious]

kunfuzious:
just think that next time you are eating your salad, or burger with lettuce and tomatoes that those "illegal" people did contribute...

LOL Will do! Thank you illegals! The billions in health care and education you syphon from tax paying Americans makes it all worth while with my Double Double. LOL

This thread is screaming to get locked...

[Youngbinks]

What about the people in our prison system? It cost the tax payer tons of money to house these scum bags and this would be away to get rid of an illegal problem and fill a void in the work force.

BTW: WTF does all this have to do with ETF?:smile:

Dang that is a bunch of anagrams.

[aenti]

I suggest this should all simmer down. Just end it. This post isn't meant to be a political discussion. Lock.

[kokogirl]

Having trouble controlling myself from getting involved with this...

Trying very hard to keep my opinions to myself...

OK. I made it through the rough part. Now I need a drink.

[Witness]

try putting yourself in these peoples shoes and their situations, imagine if your an illegal immigrant and you brought your kids here so they can have a better life , so you work extremely hard doing anything just to put food on the table,. we should just make the border more secure now, and give the illegal aliens their citizenship that some deserve . I seriously can't take this **** , too much hate going on , I'd love to live in an island far away from all this , but that's just me w/e.

[aenti]

Edited out.

[OJsakila]

Me. Self involved.
Self involved are the people who feel their country is being violated by gays and immigrants. They need to get off their high horse. They are fighting a battle not only destined to lose, but makes no sense. Who are you to care if a gay men or women get married. You are not God. You cannot use your definition of marriage to apply to everyone else.
Sorry sir, you are just not that important. So don't go around like chicken little, yelling "the sky is falling," because this issue is not a big deal. Think about it. Are illegal immigrants taking jobs from americans illgally? Who HIRES them. Not illegal immigrants. Your stupid "all-american" stores are doing the dirty deed.
Don't make up your own image of me. You don't know me and I don't know you. You can go off in rants about the things you want at any time, just don't pull me into it.

edit- I want to apologize to the op. I realize this is off topic.

I thought you didnt care...

[aenti]

Edited out.

[OJsakila]

....You are the one that said you didnt care....becuse i DO CARE doesnt make me a hate monger.....what the hell's wrong with you? I just believe differently than you...of course I'm the one thats wrong... You could NEVER be.

[aenti]

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion OJ. I'm pissed because you called me self invoved, a hen clucking around, if I am correct?
This is an issue where there is no right or wrong. There is only opinion. And although I may have made it seem that you are hate monger, I wasn't talking about you. I was talking about the general hate mongers who act that way. I'm going to edit my posts now, because I don't want to get banned for flaming. I suggest you do the same. But you seem to be so sure in your ideals. Why not explain your ideas, instead of trying to shoot down my own.
Besides, look at your posts. Sure seems like you left a lot of room for differing opinions.

OJ, you cant make statements saying I think I can never be wrong, when you started this whole thing with me because you thought YOU were right.
I don't want to argue. Lets end this, alright?

[OJsakila]

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion OJ. I'm pissed because you called me self invoved, a hen clucking around, if I am correct?
This is an issue where there is no right or wrong. There is only opinion. And although I may have made it seem that you are hate monger, I wasn't talking about you. I was talking about the general hate mongers who act that way. I'm going to edit my posts now, because I don't want to get banned for flaming. I suggest you do the same. But you seem to be so sure in your ideals. Why not explain your ideas, instead of trying to shoot down my own.
Besides, look at your posts. Sure seems like you left a lot of room for differing opinions.


Its no big deal.. I have a rep around here for purposley stirring it up. Personally, I could care less but I just couldnt resist starting this "flare up" last night. Spend a little more time around here and maybe I wont make you so mad but entertain you instead...don't fall for my crap again!:laugh2:

[aenti]

Haha, alright. I have the tendency to flare up at times. But still, haven't had a good argument in a while, so I'll have to thank you for that! :)

[Swagger]

No one but OJ, can get away with that. He is old school EIC (back then, EverythingiPhone). Don't try the antics OJ gets away with, or you could get banned. All of us old school have just learned to deal with & love him. JJ I hope you weren't offended by any of these people's closed minded comments. JJ you are also loved here, you have contributed so much. Don't let some silly comments get you down. They have the problem, dealing with diversity and change, not you.

The very people that they worship, (Conservative Republicans) started all this in which they hate. It's like an oxymoron saying that you are conservative, but hate "illegal immigration". If it weren't for the rich, republican, conservative, super companies not wanting to pay people for the jobs they do. Then we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

In closing, all you closed minded, hate everyone who isn't like you people. You better research the word GLOBAL. It is the world, the one world we now live in. You might as well get used to it and try to love one another, or you are going to be left behind...Peace & Love, Mark:laugh2:

BTW: To the (Conservative) guy crying about how much money is being wasted on "illegal immigrants". At least, those hard working people are giving someting back to the U.S.. Their long, back breaking hours of hard labor, for little pay is what keeps the U.S. economy from crumbling any further. What are you getting for the lives, plus billions & billions of dollars being wasted in Iraq??? I will answer my own question. Not a damn thing!!! But most likely, you agree with that foolishness over there, right??? All in the name of security, give me a break. Iraq will go down in history as one of the biggest lies ever told, by a sitting U.S. president. Even Bill Clinton's, "I did not have sex with that woman" pales in comparison to the lie, George Bush & Company told us American people....M

[Witness]

i love this forum
:)

[SmartAlx]

i love this forum
:)Me too. Although it isn't as polite and cordial as it once was. Waay back when when this forum was in its infancy (When the 8G iPhone was still $600) everyone was super polite and very helpful. There were very few flamefests and arguments. I remember there were discussions about how polite everyone was back then.

OJ and Swagger, you remember those days?

It's still pretty darn nice here though. My favorite iPhone forum hands down.

[OJsakila]

Me too. Although it isn't as polite and cordial as it once was. Waay back when when this forum was in its infancy (When the 8G iPhone was still $600) everyone was super polite and very helpful. There were very few flamefests and arguments. I remember there were discussions about how polite everyone was back then.

OJ and Swagger, you remember those days?

It's still pretty darn nice here though. My favorite iPhone forum hands down.


Ummm I've been here as long as you have and I've NEVER been "super polite."


J/k... I just start the trouble with these comments and all these emotionally charged ladies follow up for days... LOL! But you should know that already... its all about fun and games...

[SmartAlx]

Ah, the philosophy of your standard internet Troll. I think I understand now.


Oh, and you might have tried to antagonize people back then, but if I remember correctly, people didn't take the bait as easily as they do now. Back then everyone on the board was a super iPhone geek who'd been eagerly waiting at least 6 months for their iPhones. The board as a whole was pretty focused and charged up for the phone. Petty arguments didn't take root since we had the collective mission to find out as much as we could about the iPhone. The board now is more diluted. It includes people, you know, with normal lives. LOL And for us iPhone geeks, the novelty has sort of worn off and we have returned to our lives and hangups like the need to be right all the time.

Oh, and I've been here longer than you. See? June 2007. You've been here since July... isn't that AFTER iDay? pffft. Newbie. Didn't even experience the speculation about the iphone at everythingiphone.com BEFORE the release. Wow.

See? I'm right and you're wrong. :D

[OJsakila]

Ah, the philosophy of your standard internet Troll. I think I understand now.


Oh, and you might have tried to antagonize people back then, but if I remember correctly, people didn't take the bait as easily as they do now. Back then everyone on the board was a super iPhone geek who'd been eagerly waiting at least 6 months for their iPhones. The board as a whole was pretty focused and charged up for the phone. Petty arguments didn't take root since we had the collective mission to find out as much as we could about the iPhone. The board now is more diluted. It includes people, you know, with normal lives. LOL And for us iPhone geeks, the novelty has sort of worn off and we have returned to our lives and hangups like the need to be right all the time.

Oh, and I've been here longer than you. See? June 2007. You've been here since July... isn't that AFTER iDay? pffft. Newbie. Didn't even experience the speculation about the iphone at everythingiphone.com BEFORE the release. Wow.

See? I'm right and you're wrong. :D


oooo u got me. (quite obviously I GOT you. Sorry, Miss. All you women are always over reacting. All I said was that California judges are going against the norm... If I had known you were a female, I wouldnt have started...Sorry))

[Marcos]

lets get back to the topic on hand here. If you want to make a political statement or talk about "Illegal Immigrants" go post on a minutemen forum.

[itsnowornever]

Me too. Although it isn't as polite and cordial as it once was. Waay back when when this forum was in its infancy (When the 8G iPhone was still $600) everyone was super polite and very helpful. There were very few flamefests and arguments. I remember there were discussions about how polite everyone was back then.

OJ and Swagger, you remember those days?

It's still pretty darn nice here though. My favorite iPhone forum hands down.


WOW---this argument counts as NOT polite??? LOL...tough arguement, yeah, but still, there really wasn't flaming. I'd say about 90% of what was said was valid! LOL! But then again, this was my safe haven from the other WAYYYYY more rude forums!

[itsrainingkids]

I couldnt figure out for the life of me how a post on early termination fees got to 6 pages. Then I saw OJ!:wink:
Good Times,
Colleen

[jjvaldez]

agh we get the same ole ""that's just the way he is" BS excuse for oj... I don't care much for oj... And his Internet bully crap.. That **** would never hold up if I ever would to meet this punk on the streets...

Oj you could go on and "start crap" on here and "keep it old school" I learned to deal with you republican pussies in college...

Keep running your mouth on here .... It seems to make people happy that you do so...

It really is time this crap be closed...

[Swagger]

A Note to OJ,
OJ, you pride yourself on inciting anger and confusion in people. Which is fine, if that is the type of person you are. I have watched for over a year now, how you execute your craft. I do not agree with it, but everyone has a right to, live how they live, do what they do.

I believe that you over step your bounds. When you start disparaging people's race, religion, creed, sexual orientation, or ethnic background. The iPhone has become a huge global product. Therefore, the forum has people from all different walks of life. You constantly belittle and lambaste people different from you. Your antics have never amused me. Yet others have found amusement in your style or just "put up" with you.

When you begin to hurt people because of who they are, or what they are. Your style of posting is no longer a joke, it is an attack. Please stop, can't you see that it is not funny and you are offending people. I can't imagine a person, whom wakes up everyday just to incite anger in others.

You may need to go deep within, and take a long look at the person you are. Normal people do not act in such a manner. Chris is trying to bring new members into the forum. If I just joined EIC and saw a thread like this one. I would never return. We come here as a getaway from all that is wrong with the world, and to discuss the iPhone. Not to be pulled into an argument by you, to satisfy your own sadistic needs.

I assume from our previous conversation, that you are an adult. Please start acting like one. Didn't you learn the first lesson taught in school??? If you have nothing nice to say, say nothing at all.

I did not write this to get into an argument with you OJ. I just want you to seriously look at how you are offending and hurting others. Please, give it a rest, it has gotten very old!!! Mark

[psylichon]

Here I go talking about OJ's crap again. I swore I wasn't gonna do this...

I used to get quite upset with some of his posts, because (unlike other off-center posts from other forum members) I often truly felt he believes these things. And even more so, I feel he has trouble separating the ideas from the people. Hating anybody is a big no no in my world. These days I just try to ignore him when he goes off. But you cannot expect an entire forum community to always just "let it slide"...

He claims it's a character. I get that. But I don't fully believe it. You don't constantly dredge this sort of stuff up OT in multiple threads unless you subscribe to it.

But regardless of whether he really believes his crap or not:

Chris is trying to bring new members into the forum. If I just joined EIC and saw a thread like this one. I would never return.

This is my main argument against OJ's "antics". They just plain ol' do not belong here. Old Skool or not, things change and you have to respect the forum, first and foremost.

Come be an ass in chat, we can handle you there.

[Witness]

aren't we stooping down to his level by fighting more with him and threatning him?

[aenti]

Everybody quit it.
This post should have ended a long time ago.
No more talking about this off topic junk after this post.
And I don;t care if you want to say "its not right." Just stop. No more.
Bam.

[Witness]

Everybody quit it.
This post should have ended a long time ago.
No more talking about this off topic junk after this post.
And I don;t care if you want to say "its not right." Just stop. No more.
Bam.

why soooo seriousssss???

[aenti]

why soooo seriousssss???
I'm sorry, you
http://failblog.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/fail-owned-rule-enforcement-fail.jpg

[Witness]

I'm sorry, you
http://failblog.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/fail-owned-rule-enforcement-fail.jpg


Sadface

:(

[aenti]

Dude. You post the most irrelevant posts. In every thread.

[Witness]

Dude. You post the most irrelevant posts. In every thread.

k I'll try to make my posts more relevant just to make u happy.

[kunfuzious]

I learned to deal with you republican pussies in college...


Deleted original comment...

*Biting tongue in the interest of this forum*

Let's lock this thread already huh? Chris? John?

[blacksheep5]

Back to the original topic :)

I hope this whole thing flies, I had to pay sprint to cancel so I could get a iPhone with AT&T

[Witness]

noooo y did u bring this topic back to life!?

[blacksheep5]

either that or it was gonna get locked