Warning to those selling V1s on eBay (long)

[dcom]

I wanted to give anyone trying to sell their V1 phones on eBay a warning about fraudulent transactions that seem to be going on now that the V1 is a hot commodity.

Yesterday, I put up 1 of my 2 phones on eBay with a Buy It Now and a Reserve. Within 3 hours, I had a question from a potential buyer, asking if I could ship it to Vietnam, to which I responded that I would, for an additional amount for shipping. Small red flag went up here because I had heard that many invalid transactions come out of that area. He said he would buy it and did, using the Buy It Now.

He paid with Paypal but told me to ship the phone to an address that didn't match the address on the Paypal account. Red flag #2. Paypal always tells you (and will protect sellers that do this) to only send items to the address on the Paypal account used to pay for the item. I asked him about this discrepancy and he explained that because I hadn't indicated that I would ship Worldwide, he had to give ma a US address. Um, ok, maybe... I went ahead and started a transfer of the funds in my Paypal account to my bank account, just in case he tried to reverse the transaction.

I went ahead and prepared the package but before i shipped it, I got an email from eBay saying my listing for the phone was pulled because it was won by someone who didn't own the eBay account on which it was won. How they know this is a mystery but that was Red Flag #3. I immediately emailed the Paypal account holder and inquired if he had or knew someone who just purchased something on eBay. I also found his phone number and called but had to leave a message.

In the meantime, I contacted Paypal and gave them the information about the transaction and that I thought it may be fraudulent. The Paypal rep did a little research and came back, telling me I could go ahead and send the item, that the transaction was ok. I asked how they knew that because nothing I could see indicated that the Paypal account holder had any relationship to the person who won the auction. The rep said I couldn't see it but that the transaction was ok. That turned out to be mis-information.

About 3 hours later, I got a phone call from the Paypal account holder who said they got my email and that they did not authorize the transaction. They hadn't used the Paypal account in about 2 years, but the credit card was still active. After getting the notice from Paypal that a transaction had been made on their account, they cancelled the card, but only after it had been charged for my phone. It turns out that this person's Paypal account had been used to purchase another phone for about $1000 in the past few weeks, also to be shipped to Vietnam. The account holder had gotten the credit card company to cancel and refund the transaction amount, but they didn't close the account. Apparently, their account had been stolen and was being used by someone in Vietnam to buy phones with.

So, it looks like there may be a group of scumbags taking advantage of people wanting to sell their V1s. If you are wanting to sell your phone on eBay and can take Paypal, do NOT send it to an address other than the one in the Paypal account that paid for it. Contact the buyer through the email address in the Paypal account to verify they are the ones who won your auction. I don't know how you can stop someone from buying your item and paying for it but if there are any red flags, you should do as much as you can to verify the identity of the auction winner and that they have paid with valid funds before you send your phone out.

Because I have already transferred the amount of the transaction to my checking account, I will probably have to transfer it back to my Paypal account once it shows up in checking. If the Paypal account holder's credit card company tries to reverse the transaction, they will expect that amount to be in my Paypal account. It looks like I may have to wait a week or more to see how all this will settle out. The good news is that I am not out an iPhone and will put it back up on eBay. Hopefully it will sell to someone more honorable the next time.

[coasts]

Vietnam rulz!

[connie]

Thank God you didn't send out the phone. I have heard of other people getting ripped off like this. As a matter of fact it happened to someone on these EIC forums, they did send their phone though so they were screwed.
What I was told to do and I kind of followed along with other iphone auctions was:
1. I only would ship to U.S. I know I probably would have gotten more bids internationally but I don't care, I would rather have a sure thing than not be sure if I am being ripped off.

2. Accept Paypal verified addresses only, no P.O.Boxes either. Say you will only ship to the Paypal verified address. Every single person who bids you have the right to question them and let them know through a message to make sure they have a verified account or the transaction will not be valid.

I sold my 4g to someone in Florida for $315 and I was happy with that. It was someone who had over 100 feedback that was all positive which I knew was a good thing. That is another thing you might want to consider is accept no bids with 0 feedback.
Anyways, this was all stuff that helped me sell mine.
Good Luck!

[dcom]

Thank God you didn't send out the phone. I have heard of other people getting ripped off like this. As a matter of fact it happened to someone on these EIC forums, they did send their phone though so they were screwed.
What I was told to do and I kind of followed along with other iphone auctions was:
1. I only would ship to U.S. I know I probably would have gotten more bids internationally but I don't care, I would rather have a sure thing than not be sure if I am being ripped off.

2. Accept Paypal verified addresses only, no P.O.Boxes either. Say you will only ship to the Paypal verified address. Every single person who bids you have the right to question them and let them know through a message to make sure they have a verified account or the transaction will not be valid.

I sold my 4g to someone in Florida for $315 and I was happy with that. It was someone who had over 100 feedback that was all positive which I knew was a good thing. That is another thing you might want to consider is accept no bids with 0 feedback.
Anyways, this was all stuff that helped me sell mine.
Good Luck!

I've learned through years of being online and on eBay to be very weary of scam attempts. Craigslist is full of them which is why I won't sell there.

Selling to only US is good advice, and I think I'll do that next time. The V1 is still a desirable item even here in the US. The other phone sold in 2 hours to someone in Ireland but they had a legit account. Another thing to do is not withdraw the funds from your Paypal account immediately if you suspect fraud. Leave them there and if they get reversed, you can get Paypal to credit you the transaction fees.

[connie]

Very true, enough people here in the U.S. want them just as much as people in other countries. I think it's a safer bet all the way around. No offense to honest people in other countries but there are so many scams out there (yes I know there's scams in America too but the shipping is all around easier too). Verified Paypal address and shipping to that same address is the way to go no matter where they are.

[projectdarkside]

I guess thats why craigslist has gotten as popular as it is now :)
-Cause your gonna be doing the deal in person and will get the chance to play with the item to make sure it is like the ad said or not bricked or something :wink:

[Saverino]

I guess thats why craigslist has gotten as popular as it is now :)
-Cause your gonna be doing the deal in person and will get the chance to play with the item to make sure it is like the ad said or not bricked or something :wink:

Not really. I basically went through (or almost did) the same scam on CL.

[projectdarkside]

^^
But what makes craigslist better is that your "supposed"-:gasp:- to post an ad hoping to get buyers from your town or surrounding areas, not post and ad living in kentucky then send to someone in Russia haha :)
-Atleast thats what I thought craigslist was for :gasp:

[Saverino]

^^
But what makes craigslist better is that your "supposed"-:gasp:- to post an ad hoping to get buyers from your town or surrounding areas, not post and ad living in kentucky then send to someone in Russia haha :)
-Atleast thats what I thought craigslist was for :gasp:

I guess you're right, but still. The fact is that there are people both on ebay and CL that will try to scam you.

[projectdarkside]

I hope I never get scammed:foot:
-Cause I'm not that analytical ya kno, Im more a logical thinking kind of person. . .Well I wish I was more of a logical thinking person:tounge:

Im that playful, dont take anything too seriously, but gets the job done kinda guy so I guess I'd be an easy target :(

[jUeLz23]

yeah i recieved 2 messages already saying they would like to buy the item for like 600+ but not thru ebay. once i tell them to place their highest bid and ill close the listing they dont respond back.

so im guessing u still have ur phones right?

[dcom]

yeah i recieved 2 messages already saying they would like to buy the item for like 600+ but not thru ebay. once i tell them to place their highest bid and ill close the listing they dont respond back.

so im guessing u still have ur phones right?

I still have one of them, yes.

One other thing about selling on something like CL..don't sell it to someone saying they'll pay more than what you're offering or that they want to let an "agent" send you the money. That's a scam too. The money they'd send, even if it were a cashier's check, would be fake and you wouldn't find out about it for 2 weeks. Then your bank would take the money back from you and you'd be out the phone.

[dturner]

Glad to hear you caught things before you actually shipped. Hard to trust anyone these days. I am like Connie, I sell a few things on ebay but only ship to the US. As she said, might not get as much but I feel "safer" doing it this way. And again only to verified PayPal addresses. I only accept PayPal.

[dcom]

^^
But what makes craigslist better is that your "supposed"-:gasp:- to post an ad hoping to get buyers from your town or surrounding areas, not post and ad living in kentucky then send to someone in Russia haha :)
-Atleast thats what I thought craigslist was for :gasp:

CL is on the internet, hence it's worldwide. I can look at things that people are selling in other cities if I want to. The buyers don't always pick up the items and get to see/play with them before paying, they pay online or send payment through the mail and the item gets shipped to them same as with eBay.

[NateEssex]

Hi all. Please bare with me for a few questions, as I'm very skeptical selling on eBay or CL.

Scenario 1: I sell my iPhone on eBay. They are verified on PayPal. I send it to them. They "claim" that they never got it and want to reverse the payment or stop the payment it. How do I prove I sent it? Would I be screwed?

Scenario 2: I meet up with someone on Craig's List and show him the iPhone. He proceeds to walk out with my iPhone. I engage in a physical confrontation with him to get my iPhone back? Hope to get the police there fast?

Scenario 3: Same as Scenario 1 except they legitimately never receive it. Is there an insurance that would cover me or am I screwed?

Overall, do you have to have a high feedback score to deter people from trying to scam you? If so, how high?

Thanks for all the input. I have my OG iPhone and the bills are due ;)

[dturner]

Hi all. Please bare with me for a few questions, as I'm very skeptical selling on eBay or CL.

Scenario 1: I sell my iPhone on eBay. They are verified on PayPal. I send it to them. They "claim" that they never got it and want to reverse the payment or stop the payment it. How do I prove I sent it? Would I be screwed?

Scenario 2: I meet up with someone on Craig's List and show him the iPhone. He proceeds to walk out with my iPhone. I engage in a physical confrontation with him to get my iPhone back? Hope to get the police there fast?

Scenario 3: Same as Scenario 1 except they legitimately never receive it. Is there an insurance that would cover me or am I screwed?

Overall, do you have to have a high feedback score to deter people from trying to scam you? If so, how high?

Thanks for all the input. I have my OG iPhone and the bills are due ;)

1. Always mail items registered mail, receipt required. This way person has to sign for it and you will know they got it.

2. I would never mess with CL.

3. Yes, you can get insurance and it is very cheap. You can get it thru the post office.

[gotzaiPhone]

dude, I'm in your same boat, I got defrauded too, but like you, I still have the phone.... thank GOD!

[NateEssex]

1. Always mail items registered mail, receipt required. This way person has to sign for it and you will know they got it.

2. I would never mess with CL.

3. Yes, you can get insurance and it is very cheap. You can get it thru the post office.

Okay, let's take answer 1. What if I was a bad person and sent a registered mail iPhone box with an old Nokia phone in it, or nothing at all. I sent it registered so I have a receipt. However, how do I prove that I sent the item that I was suppose to send. It seems too easy to lie or cheat doing this. No?

2. Would you use CL in a face-to-face situation? Why not?

3. See my reply #1.

[MileHighRob]

An ex-police officer in Denver recently opened a great new business here. Basically it's a meeting place for Craigslist transactions. There are security cameras, of course, and you sign in to meet the prospective buyer/seller. IDs of both parties are checked so there's several layers of security should something go awry.

[dturner]

Okay, let's take answer 1. What if I was a bad person and sent a registered mail iPhone box with an old Nokia phone in it, or nothing at all. I sent it registered so I have a receipt. However, how do I prove that I sent the item that I was suppose to send. It seems too easy to lie or cheat doing this. No?

2. Would you use CL in a face-to-face situation? Why not?

3. See my reply #1.
1. I answered your original question. As to the one above, there has to be a certain amount of trust involved. The buyer could be asking this same question. What does the buyer do if he/she gets scammed? Always use paypal and/or credit card. This way you have protection.

2. Maybe if buyer was from my part of town. I know this sounds bad, but I wouldn't go to certain parts of my town to make a transaction. I would also be hesitant to deal with someone from said part of town. There is good and bad everywhere, but overall I just don't mess with this type of selling.

[cdinca]

craigs works great if you follow their big bold recommendation! 'deal locally, in person and in public'. It should not be used in any other way. ebay, on the other hand, is a den of thieves.

[connie]

We put a jet ski for sale on Craig's list 99.9% of the response emails were fraud.

[jUeLz23]

my listing is till stuck on 200..
doubt its gonna sell.

[connie]

my listing is till stuck on 200..
doubt its gonna sell.
I pulled my first auction for my v1 because it looked like it wasn't going to sell, I then looked and compared at all the auctions with high bids and low bids on their v1 and figured out it was all in the wording. Keep it simple and you HAVE to use words like easily Jailbroken, can easily be unlocked. Look at other auctions and look at the wording they used to sell. Also good pictures help. Polish up that iphone really well so it shows nice.

[iPhone-v2]

Ok. So here is my question:
I sold my iphone on ebay a week ago. Someone from spain purchased it. I got the payment through paypal in few hours. And I transferred it to my checking account and now to saving account. After few days the payment got cleared.
And the shipping address in non-US so its not paypal verified address. And I shipped the item to the address he sent me(madrid, spain).
I got the payment on my paypal account on 18th of this month and now its 26th July. So can I suppose that I am safe?
I am really worried as I already shipped the item and what if some fraud happens in few days or so.

Thanks for any help

[dturner]

Ok. So here is my question:
After few days the payment got cleared.
Thanks for any help
This to me answers the question. If the funds cleared you should be fine. It has been some time since I have sold anything on ebay, but if I remember right you can't transfer the money to your account until paypal has cleared the funds on their end.

[iPhone-v2]

This to me answers the question. If the funds cleared you should be fine. It has been some time since I have sold anything on ebay, but if I remember right you can't transfer the money to your account until paypal has cleared the funds on their end.
Well I already did transfer to my bank and its been 3 days since the payment is cleared.
But I am little worried after reading other views that payment can still take that money back from my bank whenever they want.. I mean what the fu**

[connie]

Well I already did transfer to my bank and its been 3 days since the payment is cleared.
But I am little worried after reading other views that payment can still take that money back from my bank whenever they want.. I mean what the fu**

I think at this point you're OK.

[dturner]

But I am little worried after reading other views that payment can still take that money back from my bank whenever they want.. I mean what the fu**
This would be the case if buyer used someone else's account to make the transaction. I think at this point you are OK. Paypal and ebay are a lot sharper the some give them credit for. I don't think it would take 3 days for them to find something wrong with this transaction.

[iPhone-v2]

I hope you both are right.:smile: So how can we avoid the fraud for sure when shipping to unverified non-US addresses.
Thanks

[iPhone-v2]

Can someone knows how many days it takes paypal or ebay to know that the payment is fraudulent? It always take 2-4 days for payment to cleared if you immediately transfer funds received from the buyer to your bank account. So if seller waits for 3-5 days before shipping the item. He/she is good to go!?

[dcom]

I hope you both are right.:smile: So how can we avoid the fraud for sure when shipping to unverified non-US addresses.
Thanks

I just got a question on this on my auction. There is a difference between confirmed and verified addresses. If an address is confirmed, you are covered by Paypal's seller protection policy. The individual who asked me the question from the auction said his address was confirmed but not verified because verification is not available where he is. Paypal said a confirmed address is covered under their policy. You can email the address in the Paypal payment notice and verify whether that is the person who bought the phone. It's what I intend to do.

[dturner]

I hope you both are right.:smile: So how can we avoid the fraud for sure when shipping to unverified non-US addresses.
Thanks
Well, this is something that I won't do. What you can do and I always do is send package registered mail-return receipt required. It is only pennies in cost and lets you know the the package was received.
As far as the payment end, fraud is out there on both ends and don't know that there is a 100% solution to stop it. You do have a protection plan thru paypal for these kinds of transactions and it is free.

[dturner]

Can someone knows how many days it takes paypal or ebay to know that the payment is fraudulent? It always take 2-4 days for payment to cleared if you immediately transfer funds received from the buyer to your bank account. So if seller waits for 3-5 days before shipping the item. He/she is good to go!?
Like I said above, I believe paypal doesn't release any funds to you until they have cleared on their end. So if paypal lets you transfer funds to your bank then you should be good to ship.

[iPhone-v2]

Like I said above, I believe paypal doesn't release any funds to you until they have cleared on their end. So if paypal lets you transfer funds to your bank then you should be good to ship.
I am reading on internet about paypal frauds and telling from whats others has written about it that They can still reverse the payment even after weeks of the shipment or payment cleared to your bank account.

[dturner]

I am reading on internet about paypal frauds and telling from whats others has written about it that They can still reverse the payment even after weeks of the shipment or payment cleared to your bank account.
That is true if you are fraudulently selling something and using paypal. But if you have done nothing wrong (and I am using you in general terms) and paypal released the funds then it becomes their problem if something went wrong.
Even if buyer used stolen identity to make the purchase, I don't think you can be held responsible if you have already shipped. This would have to be settled with the stolen credit card carrier.

[dturner]

I am reading on internet about paypal frauds and telling from whats others has written about it that They can still reverse the payment even after weeks of the shipment or payment cleared to your bank account.
Take a look at this (https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_security-center-outside) and I think you will feel a whole lot better.